If you followed my earlier discussion prior to the Edina show http://www.artfairinsiders.com/forum/topics/edina-show you may be interested in the outcome.
I was hesitant about attending as after acceptance (and paying the $400 entry fee), I was sent my booth location and it appeared to be in “the dead zone”. I communicated with the promoter my concerns and thoughts that this area should not have to pay the same as the well traveled areas of the show. She assured me that this area “has been a part of the fair for 19 years and is very well traveled and very much a part of the fair. I have several artists that request that area every year-they do well!”
With that information and initially noting on the published 2009 Edina Booth Map that there were 82 artists in that area (likely enough to bring in foot traffic). http://www.edinaartfair.com/images/BoothMap2009.pdf Information for sponsors and artists had this show’s attendance estimated at 80,000 http://www.edinaartfair.com/index.cgi?02&02 or http://www.edinaartfair.com/index.cgi?04 – which it likely had at the core area of the show. I decided to be a good sport and give it a try since I was too late to enter other shows. I appreciate I was forewarned by many of you friends but I mistakenly considered the promoter’s words would be factual. I had booth 667 in the outback area behind the Post Office.
Weather on Friday was absolutely perfect. It rained all day Saturday and occasionally on Sunday with temperature in the low 50’s. Wind was not a factor during the 3 day event. Setting aside the rain (I’ve been in far worse); I strongly feel this location should not exist in any show and the misrepresentation by the promoter is inexcusable. You can judge for yourself by checking out our You-Tube video of the show taken by my hubby. There is a total of (6) short videos. Each were taken in succession beginning at approximately 1:20 on Sunday – temperature of 52 degrees. Overall attendance on Sunday was lower than Friday especially in the 50th & France areas.
1) Dead Zone area behind the Post Office
2) Walking from Post Office area – past the food court and out into the far end of 50th Street.
3) Far end of 50th Street – past barriers, map & Info Booth and the Lund area
4) Middle of 50th out to the corner of 50th & France and back to end of 50th. Note the placement and barricade at the end of 50th.
5) Entertainment & Food Court – note most attendees found the food quality & prices much better at the local, very crowded restaurants. D’Amicos was fantastic! I stopped there frequently for hot chocolate and a few times for a yummy sandwich!
6) Returning to the Post Office Area
I will be labeling those videos better tomorrow.
https://www.youtube.com/user/njander
My area in fact had 53 artists – not the 82 that was presented on the 2009 booth map. I was told that several booth locations in that area were not used as the river of water that flowed. I was fortunate to be up against the curb/grass area directly behind the post office and did not experience that river of water my new friends directly across from me had. They did receive brooms from staff.
Since my area had little foot traffic, all artists had plenty of time to mingle throughout the three days and I did a little information gathering. ALL were upset with the layout and organizers. The artist across from me moved an oddly placed barricade that shut off patrons from entering our immediate little area. Three that had requested that area (as hailed by the promoter) were only there because they needed the grass space – either to place their lawn art on or similar reasons. They mentioned the layout in previous years had booths all along Halifax, 50th and 49th Street that led the flow to our back lot. There were no booths leading over to or connecting our area this year. One artist had a better location in previous years and wondered why they were “demoted”. The rest were new to the show or on the wait list. Many had friends in the “better” locations and checked in with them frequently as to traffic flow and sales. Several times throughout the weekend (out of shear boredom) most of the artists in my area walked out to the 50th Street area, returned very frustrated and shared info with the rest in our Post Office area. Keep in mind that the end of the 50th Street area was actually the “end” of the art show area approximately 53 booths down from “the” 50th & France core. At one point I stood at that “end” point and watched traffic flow. The organizers had placed a huge map in front of the barricade that blocked traffic from entering the booth areas (shown in video 4). While the map showed the booth layout, few looked at the map, and by design, the map and barricade served as a turn around point for the patrons. The patrons by nature turned around and went back down 50th Street as our tents were not even visible to them. There was a small sign across the street indicating that there was more art around the corner – but in that crowd and by sign location, few likely even read the sign. Recognizing we were not supported by the organizers, I tried to inform patrons that there was an additional area with talented artists behind the Post Office. I continued this routine (kind of felt like a “barker” of olden days) down the length of 50th Street. The artists in my area did notice a brief increase in foot traffic shortly after that, but not for long. I wish I was young enough to continue that process throughout the weekend, but only did it once. I was told by one volunteer that that was not allowed – I just smiled and mentioned free speech etc and nicely told her our area was receiving no traffic. My real thoughts at the time were less polite but did not express them to the woman who obviously was a volunteer and was just doing her job at the information booth.
Also interesting…. Commercial businesses (Science Diet Dog Food, Anderson Windows and others) had booths located along the more favorable 50th street area (and perhaps France, although I did not go down that far as it was quite a walk through the heavy crowd). I looked at the list of sponsors and they were not included on that list. Hmmm….. What marks did they receive on their jury submissions to be in better locations than some very talented artists? An example of that talent (other than me of course) was the artist next to me who won “Best Display”. A notable award that unfortunately did not realize sales potential due to lack of PPP (the nicer of the two meanings would be Prior Proper Planning).
Bless those Minnesota patrons. Even in the heavy rains on Saturday, they were out in full force in the 50th Street area and likely in the more favorable France area (elbow to elbow at times). From 9:30 to 3:30 on Saturday I (and other artists while during my brief absences) counted a total of 138 patrons walking through the Post Office area – many of them were family members of the artists – 6 of those were my own family members – just showing support of the artists in the “dead zone”. A few of the artists had sales during that time. One artist friend I had met at the much smaller yet fabulously run Sturgeon Bay Art Show in May had exquisite stained glass – and had pretty much sold out at the Sturgeon Bay show. I believe he had only one or two sales at this Edina show. Given the estimated attendance at 80,000 over 3 days (26,667 each day), and our foot traffic counted at 138 on Saturday between the hours of 9:30 and 3:30 – my area behind the Post Office received 0.05% traffic flow during that time slot. Granted, the numbers of overall attendance is subjective at this point, but offers the closest metrics obtainable. The artists in the Lund Store area were also frustrated with the flow design as they could only be seen by the few patrons that actually traveled down to the end of 50th, but they were actually in a better area than we as their tents could at least be seen from the 50th street area.
The rules strictly stated that no artist could leave his/her tent (pack up) until show closing each night. Saturday the show closing time was listed at 7pm. With virtually no foot traffic, continual rain and temps in the upper 40’s to low 50’s, artists in my area were not only cold and bored, they were concerned with the safety of their art and many closed up their tents for the day late in the morning or early afternoon. At 3:30 our block captains came around on their golf carts and took names of people that were still there, very upset that so many “broke the rules”. Of interest: this was the first time most of us even saw the block captain since morning start up – perhaps too boring, rainy and cold for them to venture into this back corner. I closed up shortly after that. I stayed at the Marriott which was filled with other artists from many of the location areas and we chatted most evenings. As the artists trickled into the hotel throughout Saturday afternoon/evening we cajoled each other about leaving early, yet we were confident in our decisions to protect our stock. I was told by them that many in the 50th & France area were also concerned with their product and approximately 50% of them closed up by 5pm – at which point the block captains told all they would now allow artists to pack up for the day. Interesting observation: The power of the artists as a group – most going against “the rules”, resulted in a changing of “the rules”. It will be interesting to hear what consequences fall upon those who shut down prior to 5. Note to shoddy promoters – never have all your artists stay at one or two places - word spreads quickly!
Another fact for future attendees is the much publicized and highly media advertised “Grand Old Day” held in St Paul that coincides with the Edina Fair on Sunday. Estimated attendance at that show was given at 250,000 for the annual event that includes a run/walk, parade, art fair, entertainment stages including International Performances and other fantastic venues. My nephew (art teacher) and family attended that all day event and his report estimated crowds of at least what was projected. He noted the artists there were doing a fantastic business and offered beautiful high quality pieces.
I tried to keep this report as factual as possible by gathering information from other artists & patrons and having hubby do the You-Tube video during the less rainy and highly attended Sunday. I have attended art shows as an artist and have also been on the other end as part of an organizing team annually for more than 5 years. I attend approximately 20 to 28 shows annually. My personal comments about this show are kept to a minimum at: The town and the patrons are fabulous. The Marriott showed great consideration to the artists. This area had the advantage of infrequently used thus clean port-a-potties. My sales were around $300.00. My costs were $35.00 jury fee, $400 entry fee, $354 hotel, $150 gas, minimal on food as the Marriott provided breakfast and dinner some nights – a total of $939.00 –loss of $639 that I will make up at a better organized event. My round trip mileage was at 874 miles. Lowest typical weekend event sales for me are $1,800 to $4,800 when the patron attendance is estimated at only 3,000 – far lower than the 80,000 projected (and likely achieved) attendance advertised for Edina. My potential for sales at Edina due to location, flow and overall show organization was pathetic. I was warned by many of you of the location problems and I thank you. Encouraged however by the organizer’s email and show’s published information, I remained optimistic and attended with hopes and was saddened by the experience. Putting rain and sales aside, in my opinion (and that of more than 50 artists I’ve had the pleasure of meeting and making great friendships with), this event is poorly organized. If the organization of this event does not change hands, re-evaluate its flow and prioritize its artist support, it is my hopes that it will not be artist supported and eventually die off so a better program can take its place. I will continue to support the juried shows that strive to put artist’s needs as the top priority – many of them out there! Shows like Edina will not have my support obviously. I hope others can learn, or in many cases confirm their experience, with my experience. I am fairly sure artists in better locations did quite well. My attitude is: over, done with, gone and have moved on to preparing and looking forward to Cantigny in Illinois and my subsequent shows. I do feel effective communication is essential between artist and organizer and will be sharing my experience with them, including the video so they too may recognize changes that need to be made. Thanks to many of you for your interest & support in the last month. Let’s all have a wonderful summer show season!
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Yup on all counts Ron. Rules were quite strict and defined (not artist considerate at all), but as you mentioned - rules did not apply to all equally. I was rather surprised to see one artist in my area with their van behind their booth, 5 foot tarp between the two so their dog could comfortably rest in the shade. Certainly against the rule agreement I signed on two counts. Perhaps that artist was one that requested that area. Once I saw that - my awnings front and back went up quickly. Disappointed however that you did not do extremely well given your talent & product. Oh well..... on to the next. Thanks for the input as I was hoping to hear from you.
Ron Mellott said:
Hey Linda!
I am enroute to the East coast for some shows, so I probably should be on the road driving rather than sitting here in Panera typing. But you know me ..... I can't resist!
Truly sorry Edina bit you and others there so badly. You tried to make a difference, and really did a beautiful write-up of the event. Nice job. I tried to stop by on Saturday but somehow missed your booth. Would have been good to meet you in person. We could have consoled one another on that cold, rainy day.
For what it's worth, my experience on the south end of France was similar, and my views about the show in total accordance, probably more icy. I totally agree - those booths should not exist. Bottom line is that no promoter should have such a vast discrepancy in booth locations as it pertains to an artist's ability to sell. It is wrong on every count. Shows they are not paying attention. The ability to sell to the public should be a level playing field - as much as possible. Connie should know that. No need of a merchant to attract business to their store during that 3-day event should outweigh that ability, that right, of an artist to sell, to have access to the public, an artist that pays the same booth fee as an artist in a "good" location. We are not window-dressing for the stores, or for the event. Whether or livelihood or our hobby, it is what we choose to do as artists AND as merchants ourselves. I believe there is a tacit assumption that when we apply to a show, are accepted, and pay our booth fee and drive to the event, that we each will be treated similarly to all other artists in being given an equal opportunity to sell if we pay the same price. That parking lot was NOT an equal-opportunity location. Plus after 19 years, if it is demonstrating that most artists do NOT want to be there, obviously it can't be doing too much for the local businesses in that area, can it? For the money, time and energy we expend out of our lives to come to the event, we need, we deserve, we are owed a level playing field at the start. Then, beyond that, it is what we each make of it with our work. But we have to start at the same place. If not, let us know, full disclosure, of what is happening, what may happen, and charge us less accordingly or give us the chance to withdraw - WITH FULL REFUND of our money. If a promoter spends a moment of contemplation on this, they should realize if we are handicapped by our booth location from the start, and don't do well, what likelihood is there that (a) we will return or (b) say anything good about the show to our fellow artists? How is that construed as "fair"??? And, as you posted, Rachel's responses were that lots of artists want to be there (so PUT them there and diffuse the situation! - I'm sure, for example, John Scanlon or Darren Olsen would LOVE to be in that parking area) and that your booth location was a function of your years in the show and your jury score. Duh! Honest, factual, and admitting that given a choice, artists will, for the most part, choose to be elsewhere.
As for anyone saying there were 30,000 to 50,000 people at the show ..... what? I've done shows routinely with 25,000 or more in PAID attendance and they were vastly larger than what came to Edina .... unless .... and here another specter of traffic flow and booth location looms .... people stay mostly on 50th.
As for the fairness and full disclosure, things went south from the start. The 2009 layout map showed we on south France were backed up against the curb but on arriving, found we were back-to-back in the middle of the street. I'm guessing they may have used the 2008 layout map to save time. Otherwise, obviously, no QA for accuracy. The terms as stated in the rules were everything had to be contained within the 10'x10' booth space. No space behind the booths for storage, no awnings allowed, no sitting outside the booth allowed. AND .... not all these rules applied to all booths. Those on 50th to the west of France, and in your dreaded little hole of a parking lot, and possibly those to the far NW corner of the show, had storage behind their booths, at least some of them did. This is huge. For one, setup was staggered over a 5 hr. period, yet the rules stated that they wanted France open by 7 pm on Sunday, 2 hrs. after the show ended ... and ... that we had to break down before bringing in our vehicle. If we are back-to-back with no storage, likely our storage boxes are in our vehicles, which are not present. How they think we will load our artwork without our storage containers is .... well ..... puzzling. And if we don't do that, we can't break down our booth, can we? Overall, it seemed we all paid the same fee, but were not all given comparable spaces, comparable 'amenities', or comparable opportunities to have a good show from the standpoint of sales.
On top of this is the killer to me: full disclosure happens only AFTER you have paid your booth fee ... and .... the show has a no booth refund policy. I think this is tragic, and wrong. I think ZAPP an JAS needs to be contacted regarding this. And asked, on behalf of the artists that they somewhat represent, to require any and all shows that have a no booth refund policy to state ALL their rules in their prospectus, or a link provided in the show description to their website that elucidates ALL these rules of the show, so each artists can have full disclosure before paying even a penny of their jury fee to make an informed decision if they would ever want to do a show with such restrictive rules.
Connie, what are your thoughts on this as a promoter? When your fellow promoters establish no booth refund policies but do not fully disclose such rules until after booth fees are paid, do you think that fair to artists? From a more legalistic standpoint, is any contract we agree to (e.g., agreeing to the no booth refund policy) even valid if we are not given full disclosure of the terms of the agreement? I tend to think not.
Saturday was a perfect example of where having silly rules become dysfunctional. How you display your work without an awning in the rain is ..... ridiculous. Jury-rigging visqueen with duct tape. Many of us buy good tents with features like awnings not just for protection from the sun, but for protection of our artwork and the ability to display in adverse weather. I'm not even sure why that rule existed at Edina. The street was wide enough for the widest truck to get through during setup so a fire truck should have had not problem. As far as emergency personnel, most shows I've been at in recent years have EMT's in carts or vans. Fortunately, the awning rule was not enforced (although again raising the issue brought up in other posting of shows having rules that are not enforced) ... so why even HAVE the rule? Nor was the rule about sitting outside your booth enforced although not many artists wished to test the rule. What is either rule designed to accomplish? Again, seemingly solvable by backing the booths up to the sidewalk, letting artists use the sidewalks (limitedly of course!) to store on, as they did allow booths on 50th to the west of France ..... And as many artists will attest, sitting in their booth deters a lot of potential patrons from entering. People like to look without feeling the artist at their shoulder, or that the artists is constantly watching them, which is kind of hard not to do when sitting in your booth.
IN ALL FAIRNESS TO RACHEL: Several artists that have done the show for many long years gave kudos to Rachel for the positive changes that she is instituting, so these above negative comments obviously do not reflect those positive changers. It might be good if some others posted descriptions of those good changes she has made in her short tenure as the promoter/director. Maybe given more time, she will decide to shrink the show substantially, get rid of bad booth spots, get rid of ridiculously restrictive rules, enforce the ones she decides to go with, make perhaps more sensible booth arrangements. The sad thing is, not all artists have a lot of time to continue surviving. And these changes are not that dramatic.
I am enroute to the East coast for some shows, so I probably should be on the road driving rather than sitting here in Panera typing. But you know me ..... I can't resist!
Truly sorry Edina bit you and others there so badly. You tried to make a difference, and really did a beautiful write-up of the event. Nice job. I tried to stop by on Saturday but somehow missed your booth. Would have been good to meet you in person. We could have consoled one another on that cold, rainy day.
For what it's worth, my experience on the south end of France was similar, and my views about the show in total accordance, probably more icy. I totally agree - those booths should not exist. Bottom line is that no promoter should have such a vast discrepancy in booth locations as it pertains to an artist's ability to sell. It is wrong on every count. Shows they are not paying attention. The ability to sell to the public should be a level playing field - as much as possible. Connie should know that. No need of a merchant to attract business to their store during that 3-day event should outweigh that ability, that right, of an artist to sell, to have access to the public, an artist that pays the same booth fee as an artist in a "good" location. We are not window-dressing for the stores, or for the event. Whether or livelihood or our hobby, it is what we choose to do as artists AND as merchants ourselves. I believe there is a tacit assumption that when we apply to a show, are accepted, and pay our booth fee and drive to the event, that we each will be treated similarly to all other artists in being given an equal opportunity to sell if we pay the same price. That parking lot was NOT an equal-opportunity location. Plus after 19 years, if it is demonstrating that most artists do NOT want to be there, obviously it can't be doing too much for the local businesses in that area, can it? For the money, time and energy we expend out of our lives to come to the event, we need, we deserve, we are owed a level playing field at the start. Then, beyond that, it is what we each make of it with our work. But we have to start at the same place. If not, let us know, full disclosure, of what is happening, what may happen, and charge us less accordingly or give us the chance to withdraw - WITH FULL REFUND of our money. If a promoter spends a moment of contemplation on this, they should realize if we are handicapped by our booth location from the start, and don't do well, what likelihood is there that (a) we will return or (b) say anything good about the show to our fellow artists? How is that construed as "fair"??? And, as you posted, Rachel's responses were that lots of artists want to be there (so PUT them there and diffuse the situation! - I'm sure, for example, John Scanlon or Darren Olsen would LOVE to be in that parking area) and that your booth location was a function of your years in the show and your jury score. Duh! Honest, factual, and admitting that given a choice, artists will, for the most part, choose to be elsewhere.
As for anyone saying there were 30,000 to 50,000 people at the show ..... what? I've done shows routinely with 25,000 or more in PAID attendance and they were vastly larger than what came to Edina .... unless .... and here another specter of traffic flow and booth location looms .... people stay mostly on 50th.
As for the fairness and full disclosure, things went south from the start. The 2009 layout map showed we on south France were backed up against the curb but on arriving, found we were back-to-back in the middle of the street. I'm guessing they may have used the 2008 layout map to save time. Otherwise, obviously, no QA for accuracy. The terms as stated in the rules were everything had to be contained within the 10'x10' booth space. No space behind the booths for storage, no awnings allowed, no sitting outside the booth allowed. AND .... not all these rules applied to all booths. Those on 50th to the west of France, and in your dreaded little hole of a parking lot, and possibly those to the far NW corner of the show, had storage behind their booths, at least some of them did. This is huge. For one, setup was staggered over a 5 hr. period, yet the rules stated that they wanted France open by 7 pm on Sunday, 2 hrs. after the show ended ... and ... that we had to break down before bringing in our vehicle. If we are back-to-back with no storage, likely our storage boxes are in our vehicles, which are not present. How they think we will load our artwork without our storage containers is .... well ..... puzzling. And if we don't do that, we can't break down our booth, can we? Overall, it seemed we all paid the same fee, but were not all given comparable spaces, comparable 'amenities', or comparable opportunities to have a good show from the standpoint of sales.
On top of this is the killer to me: full disclosure happens only AFTER you have paid your booth fee ... and .... the show has a no booth refund policy. I think this is tragic, and wrong. I think ZAPP an JAS needs to be contacted regarding this. And asked, on behalf of the artists that they somewhat represent, to require any and all shows that have a no booth refund policy to state ALL their rules in their prospectus, or a link provided in the show description to their website that elucidates ALL these rules of the show, so each artists can have full disclosure before paying even a penny of their jury fee to make an informed decision if they would ever want to do a show with such restrictive rules.
Connie, what are your thoughts on this as a promoter? When your fellow promoters establish no booth refund policies but do not fully disclose such rules until after booth fees are paid, do you think that fair to artists? From a more legalistic standpoint, is any contract we agree to (e.g., agreeing to the no booth refund policy) even valid if we are not given full disclosure of the terms of the agreement? I tend to think not.
Saturday was a perfect example of where having silly rules become dysfunctional. How you display your work without an awning in the rain is ..... ridiculous. Jury-rigging visqueen with duct tape. Many of us buy good tents with features like awnings not just for protection from the sun, but for protection of our artwork and the ability to display in adverse weather. I'm not even sure why that rule existed at Edina. The street was wide enough for the widest truck to get through during setup so a fire truck should have had not problem. As far as emergency personnel, most shows I've been at in recent years have EMT's in carts or vans. Fortunately, the awning rule was not enforced (although again raising the issue brought up in other posting of shows having rules that are not enforced) ... so why even HAVE the rule? Nor was the rule about sitting outside your booth enforced although not many artists wished to test the rule. What is either rule designed to accomplish? Again, seemingly solvable by backing the booths up to the sidewalk, letting artists use the sidewalks (limitedly of course!) to store on, as they did allow booths on 50th to the west of France ..... And as many artists will attest, sitting in their booth deters a lot of potential patrons from entering. People like to look without feeling the artist at their shoulder, or that the artists is constantly watching them, which is kind of hard not to do when sitting in your booth.
IN ALL FAIRNESS TO RACHEL: Several artists that have done the show for many long years gave kudos to Rachel for the positive changes that she is instituting, so these above negative comments obviously do not reflect those positive changers. It might be good if some others posted descriptions of those good changes she has made in her short tenure as the promoter/director. Maybe given more time, she will decide to shrink the show substantially, get rid of bad booth spots, get rid of ridiculously restrictive rules, enforce the ones she decides to go with, make perhaps more sensible booth arrangements. The sad thing is, not all artists have a lot of time to continue surviving. And these changes are not that dramatic.
Just a followup note: I sent an email to the organizer, the president of 50th & France as well as the Edina Art Association. I abbreviated my synopsis I posted here quite a bit and included the six videos my hubby took. Those videos pretty much speak for themselves. I doubt that I will receive a response, and that is fine as I have much to do to prepare for the better shows ahead. Thanks all for your thoughts and input. What a great group here!
Oh yes Colin - my previous post http://www.artfairinsiders.com/forum/topics/edina-show
explains the correspondence I had with the organizers PRIOR to the show about that location. I have sent a well mannered (boy I would have liked to say what I really thought) email to her after the show with no comment back yet. I believe in effective communication and try very hard to present issues by offering solutions. I typically become friends with many promoters/coordinators. I was very much mislead by her comments prior to the show and as this has been an issue in the past that has been brought up to her numerous times in the last two years, methinks that she has no intention of eliminating, or even altering that area.
Yay! You'll be in Cantigny. Let's hope for great weather & make it a point to find each other. See you there!
Colin Murray said:
I would totally agree with you Linda. I feel bad that you had a negative experience. This is a challenging way to display our art and try to make a living. Have you had any further conversations with the show organizers, beyond the block captain? I might suggest an email to the actual people in charge. You never know what they may offer you. Perhaps we will see each other at Cantigny.
Linda Anderson said:
Great News Colin.... I figured those on France would do well - afterall this is a huge show and has a history of great successes. Your post confirms my thoughts on the Post Office area however. Should not be there. The promoters really need to take another look at the event and cut down to include an area that offers prime booth areas for all artists. However, this would mean they need to eliminate at least 100 booths of their approximate 380. Writing is on the wall there - not gonna happen. They have evidentally been hearing about this problem for years - don't care. I feel badly for artists that don't have access to this forum. They will be chosen for the dead zone area next year and not have a clue.
Colin Murray said:
We are also at the Edina show, but we were on France. We were very excited about the event (being our first year) and our location. Friday sales were slow until the end of the day, when we made a big sale. More than enough to cover all our expenses. Saturday's weather affected traffic, but we found people that attended were serious buyers and we had good sales. Our block captain, Nate was very good, taking time to attend to all the booths and was always around the exhibitors. We were very happy to be told we could leave at 5:00. We quickly packed up and left. We did have 8 pieces of art that were water damaged during the day, even though we tried to protect them. We repaired the piece on Saturday night and reopened on Sunday. Sunday sales and traffic was way down. No buyers, few shoppers. Little in sales.
Overall it was our best show so far this year. The weather affected traffic. I do not think there were 80,000 people at the event. I would guess maybe 30-50,000. Most of which were on Friday. Over all we found the art-buying public feel good about spending money on art in Edina. This is not true, thus far in the Chicago shows that we have done. We will be in Hinsdale this weekend and Cantigny next weekend.
I would totally agree with you Linda. I feel bad that you had a negative experience. This is a challenging way to display our art and try to make a living. Have you had any further conversations with the show organizers, beyond the block captain? I might suggest an email to the actual people in charge. You never know what they may offer you. Perhaps we will see each other at Cantigny.
Linda Anderson said:
Great News Colin.... I figured those on France would do well - afterall this is a huge show and has a history of great successes. Your post confirms my thoughts on the Post Office area however. Should not be there. The promoters really need to take another look at the event and cut down to include an area that offers prime booth areas for all artists. However, this would mean they need to eliminate at least 100 booths of their approximate 380. Writing is on the wall there - not gonna happen. They have evidentally been hearing about this problem for years - don't care. I feel badly for artists that don't have access to this forum. They will be chosen for the dead zone area next year and not have a clue.
Colin Murray said:
We are also at the Edina show, but we were on France. We were very excited about the event (being our first year) and our location. Friday sales were slow until the end of the day, when we made a big sale. More than enough to cover all our expenses. Saturday's weather affected traffic, but we found people that attended were serious buyers and we had good sales. Our block captain, Nate was very good, taking time to attend to all the booths and was always around the exhibitors. We were very happy to be told we could leave at 5:00. We quickly packed up and left. We did have 8 pieces of art that were water damaged during the day, even though we tried to protect them. We repaired the piece on Saturday night and reopened on Sunday. Sunday sales and traffic was way down. No buyers, few shoppers. Little in sales.
Overall it was our best show so far this year. The weather affected traffic. I do not think there were 80,000 people at the event. I would guess maybe 30-50,000. Most of which were on Friday. Over all we found the art-buying public feel good about spending money on art in Edina. This is not true, thus far in the Chicago shows that we have done. We will be in Hinsdale this weekend and Cantigny next weekend.
Great News Colin.... I figured those on France would do well - afterall this is a huge show and has a history of great successes. Your post confirms my thoughts on the Post Office area however. Should not be there. The promoters really need to take another look at the event and cut down to include an area that offers prime booth areas for all artists. However, this would mean they need to eliminate at least 100 booths of their approximate 380. Writing is on the wall there - not gonna happen. They have evidentally been hearing about this problem for years - don't care. I feel badly for artists that don't have access to this forum. They will be chosen for the dead zone area next year and not have a clue.
Colin Murray said:
We are also at the Edina show, but we were on France. We were very excited about the event (being our first year) and our location. Friday sales were slow until the end of the day, when we made a big sale. More than enough to cover all our expenses. Saturday's weather affected traffic, but we found people that attended were serious buyers and we had good sales. Our block captain, Nate was very good, taking time to attend to all the booths and was always around the exhibitors. We were very happy to be told we could leave at 5:00. We quickly packed up and left. We did have 8 pieces of art that were water damaged during the day, even though we tried to protect them. We repaired the piece on Saturday night and reopened on Sunday. Sunday sales and traffic was way down. No buyers, few shoppers. Little in sales.
Overall it was our best show so far this year. The weather affected traffic. I do not think there were 80,000 people at the event. I would guess maybe 30-50,000. Most of which were on Friday. Over all we found the art-buying public feel good about spending money on art in Edina. This is not true, thus far in the Chicago shows that we have done. We will be in Hinsdale this weekend and Cantigny next weekend.
We are also at the Edina show, but we were on France. We were very excited about the event (being our first year) and our location. Friday sales were slow until the end of the day, when we made a big sale. More than enough to cover all our expenses. Saturday's weather affected traffic, but we found people that attended were serious buyers and we had good sales. Our block captain, Nate was very good, taking time to attend to all the booths and was always around the exhibitors. We were very happy to be told we could leave at 5:00. We quickly packed up and left. We did have 8 pieces of art that were water damaged during the day, even though we tried to protect them. We repaired the piece on Saturday night and reopened on Sunday. Sunday sales and traffic was way down. No buyers, few shoppers. Little in sales.
Overall it was our best show so far this year. The weather affected traffic. I do not think there were 80,000 people at the event. I would guess maybe 30-50,000. Most of which were on Friday. Over all we found the art-buying public feel good about spending money on art in Edina. This is not true, thus far in the Chicago shows that we have done. We will be in Hinsdale this weekend and Cantigny next weekend.
Thanks Paula - again, it's useful to know about the Grand Ole Days event. It doesn't get covered much as an art fair opportunity here in the TCities.
Will check it out further.
Paula Johnson said:
Linda, Thank you for the comprehensive report. I used to live in the Twin Cities and have been following your adventure here in the forums. I, like others here, was hoping for a good outcome. I am sorry the show ended up this way for you.
Your report here will serve as a warning to other exhibitors at this event. You can bet when they read about your experience they will not be eager to go into the Post Office Parking Lot. Know that sharing your Edina Art Fair experience here will help others in the future.
I looked at the map layout and shook my head. How on earth could a promoter think this location would be beneficial to exhibitors? I am calendering this event for next year. I'm going to look at the layout map next year and see if they made any changes. I don't hold out hope for layout changes because these promoters have heard these complaints from exhibitors before. They didn't listen then and I doubt they are listening now.
I have a good friend in Mpls that creates beautiful jewelry. She was in the Post Office last year and had a 'talk' with the promoters after the show. She is not eager to return to this event. She did exhibit at Grand Ole Days this year. Based on an email I got from her yesterday, I have to say she had a very successful show in St Paul.
Wishing you all the best in ALL you do. Thank you again for the time and energy you put into this report and videos.
Sorry to hear that the parking lot spaces didn't turn out well. If the location was as good as the promoter said then there would not have been almost all newbies and waitlisted people. Obviously anyone who has done the show before would not have agreed to being back there...thus the reason for 53 booth rather then 80 or so.
The promoter should be embarrassed sticking up for this area in the way she has. This is ridiculous and self serving and any promoter who has the artist's best interest at heart would be falling over backwards to apologize and promise changes in the future. (and follow through)
If this was the first year she heard negative backlash about the area, I would forgive her, but this sounds like it is an ongoing contention and something needs to be done to get her to understand that we as artists don't do shows just for the love of it, we do it to survive as artists.
Hey Promoter.....how about having the Kids Zone tent and activities back there????
Glad you had success Kerri. I thought other locations may be good as I did notice quite a few filled bags and the patrons were definately there to buy as they braved the cool & wet weekend.
Kerri Norman said:
HI All,
I'm going to give a short rundown of my Edina Art Fair experience as it seems to be different from Linda's. I'm not in any way disagreeing with Linda - just telling what happened for me. Her report is very thorough and I'm sure her concerns and observations are valid.
I was in the Lund's parking lot #468. Saturday was terrible - only one $35 sale. I left at 3:30 after asking my block captain as there was almost no traffic and by then my tent was saturated and had been leaking all day. It would have been OK if it hadn't rained ALL day, but there you go. Went straight home and bought some ScotchGard...
Friday and Sunday were very good for me - Friday being the best. We had a lot of traffic in the parking lot.
I didn't experience any problems with organization or my block captain, who was fabulous. She constantly came around checking on us all and would sit and mind any booth if the artist wanted a break. She was excellent. Hope I don't get in trouble for leaving early, though I did ask permission.
Overall my earnings were good, and I believe they would have been substantially better if Saturday's weather had been fine. I've found with jewelry that the 2nd day tends to be the best.
The Edina booth fees seem quite high, but this is my first year in better art fairs so I may have an inaccurate view of this. My app/booth/insurance fees came to about $550 and I had 3 rings stolen, so I'm down about $1000. Fortunately I was able to make enough to cover this and have ordered a locking ring case!
Thanks for info re - Grand Old Days as I didn't know there had been an art fair there and will look into it for next year.
Hope this is useful! Again, it's only my experience and I'm not disagreeing with Linda in any way :-). I'd like to see a report from someone on France. Will keep reading...
Replies
Ron Mellott said:
I am enroute to the East coast for some shows, so I probably should be on the road driving rather than sitting here in Panera typing. But you know me ..... I can't resist!
Truly sorry Edina bit you and others there so badly. You tried to make a difference, and really did a beautiful write-up of the event. Nice job. I tried to stop by on Saturday but somehow missed your booth. Would have been good to meet you in person. We could have consoled one another on that cold, rainy day.
For what it's worth, my experience on the south end of France was similar, and my views about the show in total accordance, probably more icy. I totally agree - those booths should not exist. Bottom line is that no promoter should have such a vast discrepancy in booth locations as it pertains to an artist's ability to sell. It is wrong on every count. Shows they are not paying attention. The ability to sell to the public should be a level playing field - as much as possible. Connie should know that. No need of a merchant to attract business to their store during that 3-day event should outweigh that ability, that right, of an artist to sell, to have access to the public, an artist that pays the same booth fee as an artist in a "good" location. We are not window-dressing for the stores, or for the event. Whether or livelihood or our hobby, it is what we choose to do as artists AND as merchants ourselves. I believe there is a tacit assumption that when we apply to a show, are accepted, and pay our booth fee and drive to the event, that we each will be treated similarly to all other artists in being given an equal opportunity to sell if we pay the same price. That parking lot was NOT an equal-opportunity location. Plus after 19 years, if it is demonstrating that most artists do NOT want to be there, obviously it can't be doing too much for the local businesses in that area, can it? For the money, time and energy we expend out of our lives to come to the event, we need, we deserve, we are owed a level playing field at the start. Then, beyond that, it is what we each make of it with our work. But we have to start at the same place. If not, let us know, full disclosure, of what is happening, what may happen, and charge us less accordingly or give us the chance to withdraw - WITH FULL REFUND of our money. If a promoter spends a moment of contemplation on this, they should realize if we are handicapped by our booth location from the start, and don't do well, what likelihood is there that (a) we will return or (b) say anything good about the show to our fellow artists? How is that construed as "fair"??? And, as you posted, Rachel's responses were that lots of artists want to be there (so PUT them there and diffuse the situation! - I'm sure, for example, John Scanlon or Darren Olsen would LOVE to be in that parking area) and that your booth location was a function of your years in the show and your jury score. Duh! Honest, factual, and admitting that given a choice, artists will, for the most part, choose to be elsewhere.
As for anyone saying there were 30,000 to 50,000 people at the show ..... what? I've done shows routinely with 25,000 or more in PAID attendance and they were vastly larger than what came to Edina .... unless .... and here another specter of traffic flow and booth location looms .... people stay mostly on 50th.
As for the fairness and full disclosure, things went south from the start. The 2009 layout map showed we on south France were backed up against the curb but on arriving, found we were back-to-back in the middle of the street. I'm guessing they may have used the 2008 layout map to save time. Otherwise, obviously, no QA for accuracy. The terms as stated in the rules were everything had to be contained within the 10'x10' booth space. No space behind the booths for storage, no awnings allowed, no sitting outside the booth allowed. AND .... not all these rules applied to all booths. Those on 50th to the west of France, and in your dreaded little hole of a parking lot, and possibly those to the far NW corner of the show, had storage behind their booths, at least some of them did. This is huge. For one, setup was staggered over a 5 hr. period, yet the rules stated that they wanted France open by 7 pm on Sunday, 2 hrs. after the show ended ... and ... that we had to break down before bringing in our vehicle. If we are back-to-back with no storage, likely our storage boxes are in our vehicles, which are not present. How they think we will load our artwork without our storage containers is .... well ..... puzzling. And if we don't do that, we can't break down our booth, can we? Overall, it seemed we all paid the same fee, but were not all given comparable spaces, comparable 'amenities', or comparable opportunities to have a good show from the standpoint of sales.
On top of this is the killer to me: full disclosure happens only AFTER you have paid your booth fee ... and .... the show has a no booth refund policy. I think this is tragic, and wrong. I think ZAPP an JAS needs to be contacted regarding this. And asked, on behalf of the artists that they somewhat represent, to require any and all shows that have a no booth refund policy to state ALL their rules in their prospectus, or a link provided in the show description to their website that elucidates ALL these rules of the show, so each artists can have full disclosure before paying even a penny of their jury fee to make an informed decision if they would ever want to do a show with such restrictive rules.
Connie, what are your thoughts on this as a promoter? When your fellow promoters establish no booth refund policies but do not fully disclose such rules until after booth fees are paid, do you think that fair to artists? From a more legalistic standpoint, is any contract we agree to (e.g., agreeing to the no booth refund policy) even valid if we are not given full disclosure of the terms of the agreement? I tend to think not.
Saturday was a perfect example of where having silly rules become dysfunctional. How you display your work without an awning in the rain is ..... ridiculous. Jury-rigging visqueen with duct tape. Many of us buy good tents with features like awnings not just for protection from the sun, but for protection of our artwork and the ability to display in adverse weather. I'm not even sure why that rule existed at Edina. The street was wide enough for the widest truck to get through during setup so a fire truck should have had not problem. As far as emergency personnel, most shows I've been at in recent years have EMT's in carts or vans. Fortunately, the awning rule was not enforced (although again raising the issue brought up in other posting of shows having rules that are not enforced) ... so why even HAVE the rule? Nor was the rule about sitting outside your booth enforced although not many artists wished to test the rule. What is either rule designed to accomplish? Again, seemingly solvable by backing the booths up to the sidewalk, letting artists use the sidewalks (limitedly of course!) to store on, as they did allow booths on 50th to the west of France ..... And as many artists will attest, sitting in their booth deters a lot of potential patrons from entering. People like to look without feeling the artist at their shoulder, or that the artists is constantly watching them, which is kind of hard not to do when sitting in your booth.
IN ALL FAIRNESS TO RACHEL: Several artists that have done the show for many long years gave kudos to Rachel for the positive changes that she is instituting, so these above negative comments obviously do not reflect those positive changers. It might be good if some others posted descriptions of those good changes she has made in her short tenure as the promoter/director. Maybe given more time, she will decide to shrink the show substantially, get rid of bad booth spots, get rid of ridiculously restrictive rules, enforce the ones she decides to go with, make perhaps more sensible booth arrangements. The sad thing is, not all artists have a lot of time to continue surviving. And these changes are not that dramatic.
explains the correspondence I had with the organizers PRIOR to the show about that location. I have sent a well mannered (boy I would have liked to say what I really thought) email to her after the show with no comment back yet. I believe in effective communication and try very hard to present issues by offering solutions. I typically become friends with many promoters/coordinators. I was very much mislead by her comments prior to the show and as this has been an issue in the past that has been brought up to her numerous times in the last two years, methinks that she has no intention of eliminating, or even altering that area.
Yay! You'll be in Cantigny. Let's hope for great weather & make it a point to find each other. See you there!
Colin Murray said:
Linda Anderson said:
Colin Murray said:
Overall it was our best show so far this year. The weather affected traffic. I do not think there were 80,000 people at the event. I would guess maybe 30-50,000. Most of which were on Friday. Over all we found the art-buying public feel good about spending money on art in Edina. This is not true, thus far in the Chicago shows that we have done. We will be in Hinsdale this weekend and Cantigny next weekend.
Will check it out further.
Paula Johnson said:
The promoter should be embarrassed sticking up for this area in the way she has. This is ridiculous and self serving and any promoter who has the artist's best interest at heart would be falling over backwards to apologize and promise changes in the future. (and follow through)
If this was the first year she heard negative backlash about the area, I would forgive her, but this sounds like it is an ongoing contention and something needs to be done to get her to understand that we as artists don't do shows just for the love of it, we do it to survive as artists.
Hey Promoter.....how about having the Kids Zone tent and activities back there????
Kerri Norman said:
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